Just read this Literatura Foiro article. The Civito appears to be UEA's arch nemesis. One of the comments is a blog post of someone who didn't attend the Mexican Congress because Civitanoj would be running the exams and featured (or something). He describes one of the main people involved as "in a Raŭmism idyll." Raŭmism I've heard of, but doesn't seem quite that offensive. I don't understand the connection between Raŭmism and La Civito, nor the individual controversies. What is going on here? I've read some scattered literature but I can't understand it.
Darcy Ross on Local Groups
Haroldo de Esperanto on NASK
Esperanto: Learning and Using the International Language.
By David Richardson.
See more recommendations for
beginners, next steps, and advanced readers.
Comments
Will Burundi be next?
July 27, 2009 by AMIKEMA, 17 weeks 1 day ago
Comment id: 2830
From: hassano NTAHONSIGAYE [mailto:ntahonsigayea@yahoo.fr]
Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 11:11 AM
Cc: 'Katalin Kovats'
Subject: sukcesinta kongreso
Karegaj Samideanoj,
Mi tutkore salutas vin,esperante ke vi bone fartas.
Karegaj,
Mi nun volas vin informi ke ni, Esperantistoj el Burundo,sukcese okazigis nian duan nacian kongreson de Esperanto en Rumonge. Esperantistoj el ok provincoj de la lando partoprenis la kongreson, ech kelkaj membroj de Esperanto-Civito kaj kvin skoltoj estis kun ANEBanoj. La rezulto estas kontentiga char ni entuziasme partoprenis la kongreson.
...
Mi ankaux dankas niajn monhelpantojn kaj UEA, kiuj subvenciis nian asocion por okazigi la kongreson.
La Civito
July 25, 2009 by Lee Miller, 17 weeks 3 days ago
Comment id: 2815
Jorge Camacho has written a brief satiric response to his own commentary about boycotting the 68th Spanish Congress. It's worth reading for perspective:
http://esperantarespubliko.blogspot.com/2009/07/la-unua-mk-en-kadizo.html
If "La Civito" can set itself up as the Esperanto government, so can anyone . . . the whole idea is so ridiculous it's hard to believe grown people--and competent Esperanto speakers--spend their time on it.
For myself, I want to join Camacho's Esperanta Respubliko. I'd like to be "Ministro de Hundoj, Ungo-tondiloj, kaj Teo", but first I want to discuss pay.
Lee
Is there room for one more in the future?
July 25, 2009 by Philip David Morgan, 17 weeks 3 days ago
Comment id: 2818
I'd be happy to sign up as "Ministro de Novaj Kulturo-Marmeladoj," to encourage more people to awaken their inner Craig Baldwins and Damon Packards. Of course, my command of Esperanto will need some strengthening first - in case I need to approach both of them (and others) for Eo–subtitle translation rights first.
We could also use a new way of saying "mashup." (That, and a new copy of Final Cut Express.)
Listo de ministroj
July 25, 2009 by limako, 17 weeks 3 days ago
Comment id: 2816
Neniu pagis min por plenumi mian rolon en la listo da respublikanoj.
Pago . . .
July 25, 2009 by Lee Miller, 17 weeks 3 days ago
Comment id: 2817
Nu, klare kelkaj ministroj estas gravaj, kaj meritas pagon, kaj aliaj, ne tiom. Tamen, mi taksas vian postenon tre grava, kaj bedaŭras ke tiom maljustas la vivo ke vi restas senpaga. Malgraŭ ĉio, dankon pro via servo.
LM
Ministreco
July 26, 2009 by Lee Miller, 17 weeks 2 days ago
Comment id: 2822
Mi nur volas humile informi ke mi oficiale estas nun ministro de la Esperanta Respubliko:
60 Lee, Ministro pri Hundoj, Ungotondiloj kaj Teo
Mi atendas informon pri pago . . .
LM
Gratulon kaj Dankon!
July 26, 2009 by limako, 17 weeks 2 days ago
Comment id: 2823
Gratulon pro via nova posteno kaj dankon pro la sciigo. Ĉu vi verkis vian kvaronjaran raporton?
Civito proposes itself as the government of Esperantujo
July 25, 2009 by limako, 17 weeks 3 days ago
Comment id: 2814
I agree with both Beĉjo and Tim who've captured essential elements of what La Civito is about. Another way to look at it is as an alternative structure for organizing the Esperanto community: La Civito proposes itself as the government of Esperantujo (they call it Esperantio. They claim it's a democracy and that anyone can join. All you have to do is agree to their statement of principles. But it really does look like a cult of personality around Giorgio Silfer. Personally, I'm unconvinced that Esperantujo needs a government -- or a bunch of silly titles -- if it wants to be taken seriously at all.
Perhaps it's because I'm a beginner...
July 27, 2009 by ganymeder, 17 weeks 1 day ago
Comment id: 2827
I know that Esperanto has it's own culture, etc. but I too fail to see a need for a "government of Esperantjo." I mean, why? I understand there needs to be a board or something to approve new words as they develop, but a government? I mean, isn't the point that Esperanto doesn't belong to any one country but to everyone? I tried to read the statement of principles to get the idea, but I'm still a beginner...
It's an academy
July 27, 2009 by Becxjo, 17 weeks 1 day ago
Comment id: 2829
Dear ganymeder. There is already an Esperanto academy which supervise adaptation of new words in Esperanto. There is also an Universal Organization (UEA) which provide services for Esperantists.
Civito is a sect
July 25, 2009 by Becxjo, 17 weeks 3 days ago
Comment id: 2813
The Civito is a sect around a personality cult of Giergio Silfer. It is created for providing an audience who adore and admire this person. All other things in the Civito is secondary to this.
My take...
July 25, 2009 by Tim Westover, 17 weeks 4 days ago
Comment id: 2812
I think you'll get a variety of answers to your question, but here's my (admitted biased) attempt.
If Raumism is basically the idea that Esperanto-speakers represent a linguistic diaspora (a minority culture), the Civito is the attempt to give that diaspora some sort of pseudo-state and government, with its own constitution, court, parliament, laws, elected officials, and political parties. Trouble is, it's a sham. There are only a few hundred members of the Civito at best, with 19 senate members. The leadership positions get passed around between the same people, all centered around one particular individual, Giorgio Silfer. The Civito's pompous language make its proclamations seem more important than they really are -- just pretend, sound, and fury, with no authority. The Vikipedio article on the Civito is entertaining -- see how many "legislative bodies" you can count. I think there's more than the US government, which represents 300 million people, not 300.
Libera Folio certainly isn't a neutral party. It takes great glee at the Civito's missteps and humiliations. There are deep personal and political differences between the Civito's leadership and the writers and editors at Libera Folio, especially Jorge Camacho, who has written at length against the Civito. He's probably giving the Civito more attention than it deserves, but it's good that there's a dissenting voice to the Civito's torrent of meaningless titles and proclamations.
I don't think the Civito is dangerous. I think it's silly, and it won't exist in twenty or thirty years, so it's hardly worth worrying about. Camacho's writings have helped to point out that the Civito has no clothes. I don't think that the majority of the Esperanto community takes the Civito seriously -- and rightly so.
I've interacted a few times with individual members of the Civito, even some of the senatanoj and vickonsuloj. Many are good and hardworking Esperantists, and I am happy to collaborate with them when I have the chance, even though I don't agree with the politics, tactics, or mission of the Civito. I also respect the writers and editors at Libera Folio, who are similarly good and hardworking Esperantists, and whose views on the Civito are closer to my own.